burnout

Why Does everyone like that jap crap

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toady    0

or perhaps M3Man is just too mature to stoop to that level.

 

M3's are great.

 

So are WRX's.

 

 

I wouldnt want to show up at a rally in an M3 against a WRX :)

 

Different cars for different people is really all it is. I like the 'Jap Crap' you refer to. You like nice European cars. I happen to like them too. Were i a millionaire I think the single vehicle Id be seen most in would be a brand new 911. For others it might be an NSX, or a Ford Excursion, or a Hummer, or a Dodge Viper, or some sort of Ferrari, or BMW or Bentley or Mercedes. Every car has its own sublties and nuances that draw certain people toward them.

 

Were I to want people to take me seriously, I wouldnt draw a huge brush across a range of vehicles so broad I could end up contradicting myself. ("Oh I meant Jap Crap as in these Japanese cars, not these other ones" was only a clarification you made well after your absurd original statement).

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umm, a dinan m3 wont blow the doors off a supra. the stage 3 dinan, which i think is the top of the line one, is still slower than a supra. but i think it will out handle a supra, i remember reading somehting a while back about that car handling really well... because of the rediculous camber adjustments.

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Chris V.    0

So F1 is more important because it has no turbos? What about the 1.5 liter Turbo F1 cars of the late 80s? Still unmatched in hp/liter. F1 engine formulas are just that. Engine formulas. And they are subject to change at the whim of Bernie Ecclestione, NOT becuase one way is more "superior" than another. burnout, you are a total moron.

 

You think that somehow a 4 cyl uses different engine technology that a 6, 8, or 12? For the most part, they are all 4 stroke gas engines. The original M3 was an n/a 4 cyl. The 944 Turbo is an excellent 4cyl turbo engine. Crap? I think not. Your arguments, OTOH, are definitely crap.

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SOLID STATE    0

Chris V:

"And they are subject to change at the whim of Bernie Ecclestione"

 

I think that you're talking just a little sh.it here. I mean come on, he runs the show, but he isn't dum enough just to do something on a whim.

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Burnout is right about that oval thing, I believe it is the most boring form of auto racing (if you can even call it that) there is. Drag racing ranks higher in my book. But again turbos are great, the new 911 Turbo conjures up an amazing 415 pound feet of torque from 2500-4700 RPM. Where is the turbo lag in that?

 

About that CART vs. F1 thing, a Champ car is slightly heavier but a bit more stable and a little more drivable. Which means the car is less likely to spin or burn the tires out of a turn. A F1 car is a little down on power but is very touchy, all of the power in both cars is developed in the high range. But with normal aspiration in the high revs you have very little torque. So in their present forms a CART car would beat a Formula 1 car, now if the tires on a Formula car didn't have the grooves, then it would be a race.

 

About Bernie Ecclestone, isn't he selling part of his stake in Formula 1? If so would things get better or worse?

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gimpyben    0

How can you segment turbo cars by country, this makes no sense, they all follow the same principal and while the parts may be of different manufacture, the physics are the same. And why the comparision between the WRX and the M3, this is like comparing a dirt bike to a sportbike, just apples to oranges man. I love Japanese cars and I drive Japanese cars, but I'll tell you, the best turbo car isn't Japanese or even European. (Suspend your disbelief, and please don't laugh cause i'm dead serious) The Dodge Omni GLH, book value=almost nothing, has a Carrol Shelby designed 2.2L turbo I4, makes about 210hp stock (give or take a small bit) in a car that weighs about as much as a large riding lawn mower. Buy a mod chip to increase the boost to around 25 psi and you have a car that can out accelerate just about anything on the road, screw refinement, you own a >$2500 car that will spank just about anything out there.

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C-MURDER    0

While they may not be the best those Chrylser turbos where pretty sweet and definetly under rated. Cars like:

Chrysler Conquest

Dodge Daytona

Dodge Omni/Shelby GHL(sp?)

Dodge lancer

Dodge Shadow/Shelby CSX

Plymouth Laser RS

 

Even Ford has had turbos with the Escort and Probe, and so has some GM cars.

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gimpyben    0

i'll be the first one to say the Omni's looks and reliability are crap, however my sick sense humor makes me love the idea of a $2500USD econobox that will beat a VR-4 or a Z28, and it will, i've seen it happen.

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Xzotyqar    0

Burnout: Since when does "bolting on a turbo" make a stock engine a non-stock engine (for your so called Jap crap?). Isn't that like saying an M3 is a "bolting on performance parts" onto a stock 4-cyl? Rubbish. An M3 is not a regular stock 1.6L 4-cyl. cheapo BMW, bored out and "modified", is it? A stock turbo japmobile is just that, stock. It wouldn't make sense for them to make 5-litre+ 8-cylinder engines just so they can make little WRX's go faster does it? (The Viper is a perfect example of let's put that mutha of a truck engine, and massage it to sportscar spec requirements.)

Any idiot can do "off-the-shelf" engineering.

Can any stock or modified stock American sportscar do the North/OldRing Nurburg-Ring (Germany) in under the so-called "8-minute" barrier? (Racing cars had broken this barrier long time ago; they don't count if you can't buy them from your friendly local dealer.)

The japcrap Nissan Skyline was the first production car to ever break that barrier. (News spread in auto journals...) The German's pissed in their pants when this embarrassing thing happened because they had not accomplished this. They were so upset they immediately regrouped to break that same barrier themselves. (Porsche finally succeeded later on and especially made the effort to make it "official" event; but neither Audi, BMW, Mercedes-Benz, or anyone else have yet to do so... except a stock Twin-Turbo Supra.)

Can a stock Corvette or Viper do this, or would these end up down the valley in the weeds trying it?

Read it and weep: (you don't need to fully understand German to pick out the time figures): http://www.motor-presse-online.de/Zeitschr...nhalt/4reko.htm

You'll notice that the Nissan Skyline's record is nowhere mentioned. After all, when that team broke the record, the German onlookers were skeptical, and they weren't willing to nor give them credence for the effort. They only sat up and took notice, when others (journalists? sportcar enthusiasts?) took notice and spread the news. Do you think they would let "japcrap" beat them in their own backyard?

Keep in mind, anytime there is a sportscar comparo, they do them under limited conditions, on the local roads in one country and maybe one race track.

The only way you're going to do it right (scientifically) is get a random sample from dealers/owners of each car type, get more than one example of each, say 5, (yes, this is very expensive to do.) Pick different tracks of all types of configurations, high-speed vs windy road type tracks, short tracks vs long tracks (The Nurburg-Ring is 15 miles long!) Test them all, using seasoned racedrivers accustomed to the make and configuration. See who comes out on top; you'll learn what does best where. No replacement of busted cars. You get equal amounts of fuel, same number of extra sets of wheels if necessary. No replacements otherwise. Drive them around the track to see who sets the fastest lap record, shortest laps, go the furthest under varying time limits, 10 minutes, 20, 30, 60, 120, 240, 360, 480, 600, etc. Sounds fair?

Okay, maybe it is easier just to go to every track to find out if they log lap records for each category of cars...

I wonder who will break japcrap Honda's 1.5-litre Turbo V6 record for winning 15 out 16 races in one F1 season? Will it be a European engined car, or an American engined car? Hmmm? When they do, will people say, Oh, that's old japcrap 2nd millenium news... you're still trying in the 3rd millenium??!

Yup, Ferrari may be the winningest team in history, but aren't they also the losingest too?

To others:

Regarding fast seeedaans...

Okay, okay, fast seeedaans are okay so long as they are like those M3's, M5's, WRX's, EVOs, Nissan Sunny GTiR's?, Skyline's (remember Japanese also can't afford exotic cars (Lambos/Ferraris/Porsches), so they buy these cheaper japanese sporty versions of econo-seeedaan/coupes (non-swoopy type) of what NorthAms "Pontiac Sunfire GTs"), Audi's...

Opel Omega AWD Turbo6's of the 80's...

While the rest of us drool over the japcraps more affordable rocket seeedaans.

(Remember the new Mustang GT 260hp, wow! what a revelation boy racer! is now the same hp as a luxo/sporty Acura CL-S "Accord" based bread 'n butter yuppy "just-cruise-comfortably" fast, yes "affordable", seeedaan.)

 

 

[This message has been edited by Xzotyqar (edited 06-02-2000).]

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Xzotyqar    0

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!

An F1 car passing by.

 

whah-w-w-w-wha-wha-wha-w-w-wha-wha-wha!

13 Nascar cars passing by.

 

Brrrraaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaflak!

Brrrraaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaflak!

2 dragsters going down the strip (with chutes opening at the end.)

 

Rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrkshuuu(flash)!

Starship Voyager doing its warp thing.

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